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Bajjar Kurehat and Panj Pyare
Posted by: Bijla Singh (IP Logged)
Date: July 14, 2008 12:54PM

I have often heard that one who commits bajjar kurehat cannot be part of Panj Pyare ever even if they have been pesh and taken Amrit again. What is the reason for this? Does this also apply to monay as well? Why and why not?

 



Re: Bajjar Kurehat and Panj Pyare
Posted by: Atma Singh (IP Logged)
Date: July 15, 2008 09:34AM

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

veer bijla singh jee,

my understanding is that those who have taken amrit and THEN committed a bajjar kurehit are not able to carry out his seva.

therefore, it literally doesn't matter what one has done BEFORE taking amrit - they may have been the most sinful person on the planet. however, they can be considered for this seva if AFTER taking amrit they have not commited any bajjar kurehitaa(n).

amrit is a new birth - karam naash (literally wiping away/destruction of sins/negative karams) takes place so we are forgiven for what we have done previously, as long as we stay sincere to maharaaj jee thereafter.

if i am wrong, please can more knowledgeable members of the sangat give the correct undertsanding.

ps - bhai sahib raNdheer singh's tract 'amrit kee hain' is easily the best source i have ever read re: panj piyaarae, amrit sanchaar maryada, purpose of amrit, nature of amrit etc. i would recommend you read this if you haven't already.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

ਦਾਸ,
ਆਤਮਾ ਸਿੰਘ

 



Re: Bajjar Kurehat and Panj Pyare
Posted by: Bijla Singh (IP Logged)
Date: July 15, 2008 11:04AM

That is the confusing part. If a mona can take Amrit which is a new birth and be part of Panj Pyare then how is that different with anyone else taking Amrit again? Isn't taking Amrit again a new birth? If a 10 year old child takes Amrit, doesn't keep rehat, does bajjar kurehats and then returns to Sikhi and takes Amrit, what is wrong with him being part of Panj Pyare so long as he is a rehatvaan gursikh? Sikhi is universal and ultimate truth so bajjar kurehat should be applied to others equally. It would make no sense if a Sikh was punished in hell for cutting kes and not a mona. Both did the same thing or are bajjar kurehats only applicable to Amritdharis? I would appreciate someone making it clear for me.

 



Re: Bajjar Kurehat and Panj Pyare
Posted by: Atma Singh (IP Logged)
Date: July 15, 2008 02:53PM

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

veer jee,

the way i look at it is that someone who takes amrit and then commits bujjar kurehitaa(n) has taken a major downfall. maharaaj jee may forgive them and bless them with amrit again however, the condition is that they cannot do this most highest seva.

my belief is that to be blessed with and to commit to panj piyaarae dee seva is such a massive responsibility that there have to be very strict conditions. my understanding is that the panj piyaarae temporarily become the literal physical and spiritual roop of siree dasmesh pita jee. pita jee's kalaa fully operates through them from the beginning right to the end of the amrit sanchaar. each one of these gursikhs must live in a state of submission to siree dasmesh pita jee.

ideally, and for an amrit sanchaar to have pooran kirpa, they must be jyot vigasee. however, my gut feeling is that such an opportunity must be very rare given the dehndee kalaa of the panth at the moment. we know during the times of bhai sahib raNdheer singh that amrit sanchaars took place where all panj piyaarae were jyot vigasees. now, i think we should count ourselves really blessed if we can pesh at an amrit sanchaar where full maryada is operating, where the panj piyaarae are strict in their naam abhiyaas, gurbaaNee abhiyaas and rehit. this is our best hope to get dasmesh pita jee's blessings and kalaa at the moment.

given the incredible importance of this seva, one way of seperating the definitely capable from the potentially incapable is to ensure that those who do the seva have understood the responsibility that comes with amrit i.e. they have not committed bajjar kurehitaa(n) after taking amrit.

bajjar kurehitaa(n) can be committed by anyone i.e. most of the world commits all of them very often. however, for a gursikh, they represent spiritual death unless that individual goes pesh. with this maha-kirpa also comes maha-responsibility. it is a bigger deal if those who know better do something very negative. those who are ignorant at least have that as a valid excuse.

we have been placed onto Gurmat Maarg - the path to milaap with Vaheguroo. we should expect there to be major responsibilities and expectations placed upon our shoulders. we should stay in a state of ardaas and beg that Vaheguroo protects our honour. Vaheguroo actually covers-up our mistakes all the time so that our honour is protected. Vaheguroo makes others honour us even though we are so feeble and powerless. whatever we can do, whatever we can obey in return is seriously minimal.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

ਦਾਸ,
ਆਤਮਾ ਸਿੰਘ

 



Re: Bajjar Kurehat and Panj Pyare
Posted by: Anonymous User (IP Logged)
Date: July 16, 2008 01:57AM

Gurfateh

Dear Brother Bijla Singh ji,

How are you.It has been long hearing from you.(das has some topics to be discussed with yourself so if possible send your email id to das 's address akalustatvijay@yahoo.com.

coming to the topic.

Well if some one is mona by birth and non Sikh,he could bea panj piara after undergoing baptism.We had lists of non sikhs becoing the Sikhs and then great gursikhs like Prof. Sahib Singh Ji,Bhagat Puran Singh Ji,Bhai Rama Singh Ji among others.So in there there is no problem.

Problem could be with those Amritdharis only who became apostates or patit.As in past they did not obey the orders of Panj Piaras themselves then it could be a bit unfair for them to preach same to Amrit Aspirants.

Yet in our Panth Akal is supereme and Guru roop Sadh Sangat is Supereme.Akal is not bounded by any rules and could make and break rules as Akal decides.

So Even a patit,who is readmited to Panth and behaves like other amritdharis after reconversion.Could be a Panj Piara if Sangat allows and situation demand like.
1.He/she is well versed with any of the five banis and there is no other person is awailalbe who has Bani Kanth(rembered).
2.There is shortage of an Amritdharis.
3.As an Amritdhari person in question is ready to go to a remote loaction for the conversion ceromony and there is no other person to substitute him.

Das has given his views based upon how we could behave when we carry out Baptism in Budhadal or what the missionaries could think.Das anyway respects the views of AKJ and DDT.

 



Re: Bajjar Kurehat and Panj Pyare
Posted by: Bijla Singh (IP Logged)
Date: July 16, 2008 12:52PM

If a young child was given Amrit, kept no rehat and later did bajjar kurehat and then came back to Sikhi after learning the truth what would be the decision about him doing this seva? Keep in mind that Bhai Rama Singh Ji prior to taking Amrit did two bajjar kurehats but his bhagtee was so much that Guru Sahib chose him for this seva. So my point is that any person who does so much bhagtee should be eligible for such seva regardless of their bajjar kurehat as mona or Amritdhari. Coming in Sharan of Guru Sahib with pure intentions is more than enough. Putting Amritdharis in a different category for doing the same bajjar kurehat seems unfair to me. Bhai Rama Singh Ji states in his book that monay are punished for cutting hair and he was punished for adultery. So Waheguru applies bajjar kurehat to everyone equally. Clearly, monay are punished and therefore are held responsible for this sin regardless of their awareness and intentions. I understand that this seva is huge and not everyone deserves it but a patit can take Amrit again and become a jyot vigasi. Then why does he not qualify? If he can become one with Guru Sahib at spiritual level then why can’t he be part of Guru Roop physically?

 



Re: Bajjar Kurehat and Panj Pyare
Posted by: satnam22 (IP Logged)
Date: July 26, 2008 01:32AM

WJKK WJKF
Dear Bilja singh, you wrote:
"Bhai Rama Singh Ji states in his book that monay are punished for cutting hair"

I have "In search of the true guru" by bhai rama singh, can you please tell me where you found this in his book - as far as I can remember I don't recall Bhai sahib saying this. Thanks..

WJKK WJKF

 





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